State may track cellphones for traffic data

SPEED · 10-17-2005, 08:09 PM

State may track cellphones for traffic data......

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl...ry/Technology/

"Officials say there's no Big Brother agenda in the Missouri project â€” the data will remain anonymous, leaving no possibility to track specific people from their driveway to their destination" ......Suuuuuuuuuuure :bs

gsxr-71 · 10-18-2005, 10:45 AM

Back when I lived in Fairfax, VA, I had some friends at SAIC in Virginia who were working on a system to track traffic speeds using cell phones.

That was in the 1993/4 time frame.

Looks like it must be ready for prime time.

It won't be long before if you don't want anyone to know where you are you'll need to keep your cell phone turned off. If it is on, even though you aren't talking on it, your location will still be given away.

There are a lot of privacy issues surrounding this technology besides Big Brother knowing where you are and where you've been, advertisers for example want access to that data so they can tell where you shop.

There have even been smart billboards designed that will target customized displays at you when you're within visible range.

But back to BB, LE applications could include setting up filters to track the cell phones that drive through known drug areas and pause more than once. When they get a hit on someone they can then set up targeted surveillance and pop goes the druggie. Same for houses of ill repute

, murder scenes, and crime in general.

The list goes on . . .

mrXBma · 10-18-2005, 01:38 PM

I get no recpetion here so my phone is turned off anyways. Its almost worth investing in old technology so it wont be able to track it

SolidForce · 10-18-2005, 04:17 PM

I'm sure you will be able to setup some sort of GPS scramble or removing sometime....A bunch of geeks out there wont stand for it and program some firmware to kill it

-SF

Throttlepimp · 10-18-2005, 05:22 PM

So yeah when you call me please leave a message... :flipper

spy98 · 10-19-2005, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SolidForce

I'm sure you will be able to setup some sort of GPS scramble or removing sometime....A bunch of geeks out there wont stand for it and program some firmware to kill it

-SF

I believe jammers and scramblers are all pretty much illegal under FCC regulation (something about transmission power and frequence ranges I believe are regulated).

Now putting your cell phone in a lead box...

SolidForce · 10-19-2005, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spy98

Quote:

Originally Posted by SolidForce

I'm sure you will be able to setup some sort of GPS scramble or removing sometime....A bunch of geeks out there wont stand for it and program some firmware to kill it

-SF

I believe jammers and scramblers are all pretty much illegal under FCC regulation (something about transmission power and frequence ranges I believe are regulated).

Now putting your cell phone in a lead box...

not a scrambler but a new firmware that disables the gps tracking.

-SF

gsxr-71 · 10-21-2005, 08:19 AM

First, let me say that I'm not a cellular communications engineer, I work mostly on satellite communications systems, but I do know something about the technology.

The location data that SAIC derived way back when was not GPS based.

All cell phones register with the carrier when they are first turned on. Then they periodically transmit messages to the carrier in response to status polls.

Any time the cell phone transmits, its location can be determined by a number of methods. For example, triangulation and / or time difference of arrival.

Typically, your cell phones transmissions are received by several cell towers at the same time. Your phone call communications are routed through the one that was selected through a voting algorithm, i.e., has had the best reception for a while and has spare capacity, etc.

As GPS technology gets less expensive in the future, it will be added to cell phones for a couple different reasons, but currently that's now how they track the phones.

Don't expect to be able to disable the tracking feature any time soon

Kent · 10-21-2005, 09:40 AM

I believe the CHP dispatch here in SoCal has the ability to track you when you call 911. I think it is only in certain areas.

Kent

gsxr-71 · 10-21-2005, 10:22 AM

There is an E-911 initiative that requires all providers who terminate voice calls to provide location information for 911 calls - including voice over IP calls that use the Internet be it a terrestrial wired connection or wireless.

It's of particular interest to me because we have a number of satellite based Internet products where you could be anywhere in the satellite's footprint. Some of the systems, like our Internet to commercial jet liners and for business jets do have access to location data, but others currently do not.

So pretty soon, figure on the man knowing where you are anytime you are using a telephone - even if you aren't dialing 911.

There is a 2nd thing called CALEA or communications act for law enforcement agencies that the departments of Homeland Security, etc., are trying to get beefed up that lets them tap into both data and voice comms over Internet. So eventually they'll be able to sniff your email or IM, or VoIP traffic when you're sitting at Starbucks or at 35,000 ft surfing the web.

I recommend PGP or similar public key encryption software to everyone.

10-17-2005, 08:09 PM	#1
SPEED Administrator Tournaments Won: 2 Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: So Cali Bikes: '07 Honda CBR600RR, Cag Pocket bike Age: 43 Posts: 10,916 iTrader: (5) Rep Power: 15 (42)	State may track cellphones for traffic data State may track cellphones for traffic data...... http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl...ry/Technology/ "Officials say there's no Big Brother agenda in the Missouri project â€” the data will remain anonymous, leaving no possibility to track specific people from their driveway to their destination" ......Suuuuuuuuuuure :bs __________________ Live to ride another day!" SIGN UP HERE --> "Zoomsplat" -Wingers" SPORTBIKES WEST.COM User Maintenance General Forum Usage Reading and Posting Messages

10-18-2005, 04:17 PM	#4
SolidForce Know It All Join Date: May 2005 Location: Santa Clarita Age: 26 Posts: 372 iTrader: (0) Rep Power: 4 (27)	I'm sure you will be able to setup some sort of GPS scramble or removing sometime....A bunch of geeks out there wont stand for it and program some firmware to kill it -SF __________________ *Yaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr! FTW!!!!!!!!!!!!*

10-18-2005, 05:22 PM	#5
Throttlepimp Track Junkie Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: South of the 78. Posts: 1,203 iTrader: (0) Rep Power: 5 (39)	So yeah when you call me please leave a message... :flipper __________________ An adreneal gland is a terrible thing to waste...

10-21-2005, 09:40 AM	#9
Kent Canyon Carver Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: My Town, Missouri!! Posts: 639 iTrader: (0) Rep Power: 4 (10)	I believe the CHP dispatch here in SoCal has the ability to track you when you call 911. I think it is only in certain areas. Kent __________________ http://www.palomarpics.net/BannerSBW.jpg

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

10-18-2005, 10:45 AM	#2
gsxr-71 Newbie Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 31 iTrader: (0) Rep Power: 0 (10)	Back when I lived in Fairfax, VA, I had some friends at SAIC in Virginia who were working on a system to track traffic speeds using cell phones. That was in the 1993/4 time frame. Looks like it must be ready for prime time. It won't be long before if you don't want anyone to know where you are you'll need to keep your cell phone turned off. If it is on, even though you aren't talking on it, your location will still be given away. There are a lot of privacy issues surrounding this technology besides Big Brother knowing where you are and where you've been, advertisers for example want access to that data so they can tell where you shop. There have even been smart billboards designed that will target customized displays at you when you're within visible range. But back to BB, LE applications could include setting up filters to track the cell phones that drive through known drug areas and pause more than once. When they get a hit on someone they can then set up targeted surveillance and pop goes the druggie. Same for houses of ill repute , murder scenes, and crime in general. The list goes on . . .

10-18-2005, 01:38 PM	#3
mrXBma Administrator Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: So cal Posts: 927 iTrader: (0) Rep Power: 5 (32)	I get no recpetion here so my phone is turned off anyways. Its almost worth investing in old technology so it wont be able to track it

10-21-2005, 08:19 AM	#8
gsxr-71 Newbie Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 31 iTrader: (0) Rep Power: 0 (10)	First, let me say that I'm not a cellular communications engineer, I work mostly on satellite communications systems, but I do know something about the technology. The location data that SAIC derived way back when was not GPS based. All cell phones register with the carrier when they are first turned on. Then they periodically transmit messages to the carrier in response to status polls. Any time the cell phone transmits, its location can be determined by a number of methods. For example, triangulation and / or time difference of arrival. Typically, your cell phones transmissions are received by several cell towers at the same time. Your phone call communications are routed through the one that was selected through a voting algorithm, i.e., has had the best reception for a while and has spare capacity, etc. As GPS technology gets less expensive in the future, it will be added to cell phones for a couple different reasons, but currently that's now how they track the phones. Don't expect to be able to disable the tracking feature any time soon

10-21-2005, 10:22 AM	#10
gsxr-71 Newbie Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 31 iTrader: (0) Rep Power: 0 (10)	There is an E-911 initiative that requires all providers who terminate voice calls to provide location information for 911 calls - including voice over IP calls that use the Internet be it a terrestrial wired connection or wireless. It's of particular interest to me because we have a number of satellite based Internet products where you could be anywhere in the satellite's footprint. Some of the systems, like our Internet to commercial jet liners and for business jets do have access to location data, but others currently do not. So pretty soon, figure on the man knowing where you are anytime you are using a telephone - even if you aren't dialing 911. There is a 2nd thing called CALEA or communications act for law enforcement agencies that the departments of Homeland Security, etc., are trying to get beefed up that lets them tap into both data and voice comms over Internet. So eventually they'll be able to sniff your email or IM, or VoIP traffic when you're sitting at Starbucks or at 35,000 ft surfing the web. I recommend PGP or similar public key encryption software to everyone.